Do You Lose Sleep over Heroes?

[bumblebee]

Over the years the issue of heroes showing stuff to girls has cropped up on all boards.  We seem to have been lucky here as it has seldom been a big problem, probably because we are small and don't attract too much attention, or else you guys don't make a song and dance about it if you have been on the receiving end of some malicious behaviour and so we don't hear about it.

 

So does the fact that heroes are no doubt out there affect what you post here, and if so, to what extent?

[JaiDee]

It used to be an issue for me years ago when I posted much more, BB....some loser would try to curry favor with some ladyboy by telling her what I may have said or done, etc.....these days I don't post as much so it's not an issue, but I could see how it would make some guys be hesitant about pulling the trigger on posting photos or some trip report activities.

 

   I never really understood the use of the word 'hero', to me anyone who does that shit are just a bunch of pussies who should be avoided at all costs.

[Luung]

Well I don't lose any sleep, but apart from lack of time, 'heroes' are the other main reason why I don't post so much, I've got so much to say, even currently, but daren't!

 

The problem will be here as much as it is in any other forum, it's just the nature of ladyboy adulation, I'm afraid.

 

It's funny, before being ejected (first time around) from that other site I started lumping most forum inclined LB fanciers into four main categories, 'the swinging handbag brigade', 'the good ole' boys', the 'sycophants' & 'the lads'... See yourselves in here anywhere??

 

Anyway, the problem is the sycophants, for a lot of the time they just can't fuckin' well help themselves, they're so deeply infatuated with lust & feelings of assumed closeness after a couple of LT sessions of gut wrenching, bollock blistering, helmet hammering, meaningful, anal sex in some scabby hotel room with their current objects of desire that it far out ways & overrides any other sensibilities... And they'll do anything to carry favor, all sneaky & all behind your back too! .. They're just too far gone... Most of these blokes could be robbed, have their teeth kicked & then have the LB wipe their own excrement in their faces... And they'd still say, "I love yoo"!

 

 

So that's it, I've been 'heroed' a few times & there's those who've got their finger on the trigger ready to do it again... And I know that it comes just as much from within the circle as out of it.

 

Funny thing is I usually have a laugh with the girls about it & they invariably hate the, "yak, yak, yakking, im' talk tooo muuuuch", hero, as well!!!!

 

So stop it, it's not big, it's not clever & it's definitely not very grown up... And you really won't be getting any brownie points for it either!

[JaiDee]

I'm guessing that its use is meant in an ironic, rather than in an entirely literal, sense.

 

   Well, of course I know what the word 'hero' means.....I guess I just never understood it in the context of these various forums.  So these asswipes who report what is said on these forums back to the ladyboys, or who report that their photos may have been posted without their permission, are called Heroes by the guys who they tell on.

 

 Again, I understand the context, I am just more comfortable calling them what they really are; dickless assholes.

[Jimslim]

 

 

Anyway, the problem is the sycophants, for a lot of the time they just can't fuckin' well help themselves, they're so deeply infatuated with lust & feelings of assumed closeness after a couple of LT sessions of gut wrenching, bollock blistering, helmet hammering, meaningful, anal sex in some scabby hotel room with their current objects of desire that it far out ways & overrides any other sensibilities... And they'll do anything to carry favor, all sneaky & all behind your back too! .. They're just too far gone... Most of these blokes could be robbed, have their teeth kicked & then have the LB wipe their own excrement in their faces... And they'd still say, "I love yoo"!

 

 

Sheer poetry brother Lung .

 

Another factor is that a lot of these guys are basically bores devoid of personality .

 

I've lost count the amount of times I've heard some guy using the chat up line of "Yes I see your picture on the internet " when a girl introduces herself in the bar .

 

Why do they need to say that ? My theory is they got nothing else meaningful to add .

[fogmaster]

Having been hero'd a couple of times, I can say I haven't lost any sleep over it but I have certainly become much more cautious about my posts/TRs. I used to have a "damn the torpedoes" attitude, but definitely censor myself now and won't chime in/add content as freely on topics as I'd like to knowing that a particular comment or photo could be pointed directly back at me.

 

It sucks that there are weak people out there that feel the need to do this, but I still enjoy writing my daily of TRs on the ground too much to let these heroes stop me. I just have to THINK before posting now.

[fogmaster]

 

 

Anyway, the problem is the sycophants, for a lot of the time they just can't fuckin' well help themselves, they're so deeply infatuated with lust & feelings of assumed closeness after a couple of LT sessions of gut wrenching, bollock blistering, helmet hammering, meaningful, anal sex in some scabby hotel room with their current objects of desire that it far out ways & overrides any other sensibilities... And they'll do anything to carry favor, all sneaky & all behind your back too! .. They're just too far gone... Most of these blokes could be robbed, have their teeth kicked & then have the LB wipe their own excrement in their faces... And they'd still say, "I love yoo"!

 

 

 

 

Great turn of a phrase Lung!!! 

[dixon cox]

I've lost count the amount of times I've heard some guy using the chat up line of "Yes I see your picture on the internet " when a girl introduces herself in the bar .

 

Why do they need to say that ? My theory is they got nothing else meaningful to add .

 

When that happens I cringe too. It's embarrassing just to be in the vicinity as it adds to the Thais belief that all farang are just stupid buffalo. Also, after it's been said you can see the dollar signs spinning in her eyes like a one-armed bandit and you know the sound of a cash-register is ringing inside her head.. ker-ching!

 

 

I lose no sleep over any so-called hero as I gave up posting pics-for-kudos long ago, even then it was only ever minimal. Leave it to the noobs and those seeking forum recognition to do all that. They can then fly home out of harms way until next year's two week bonanza by which time it will hopefully all be forgotten.

[JaiDee]

 Let me ask you guys one thing which is kind of related to this thread.

 

  Do you trust what the Ladyboys say, or what your male friends say?  Or even males in general?  I mean, if an LB tells you something and a guy you may know or may know just a little bit tells you something completely different, who would you believe?

 

 As in .....a girl may say "I see Johnny at the bar last night" and then you see Johnny and say "hey, did you go to the bar last night" and he says no way, I would tend to believe the male westerner first, even if I know him only nit noi.

 

IMO most of these people lie for a living - and we we all know many Thai's are very comfortable lying to westerners because they say it's not a lie if it's not in their language LOL -  so I would never take the word of a ladyboy over a male westerner, unless I had proof he was some kind of an asshole and a known liar.

 

     Anyway, I think this relates to "heroes" because some of them may lie to an LB about one of us to gain favor with her, and then lie to us so about it so as not to lose his standing with her.  Again, a bunch of pussies.

[pacman]

Do you trust what the Ladyboys say, or what your male friends say?  Or even males in general?  

 

I take everything said to me on trust but I filter it through all that life has taught me. So someone I know well will be believed but someone I don't know won't be given the same degree of trust. It is all a case of degrees. Casual acquaintances raise suspicions quicker than close friends. But most people are fine. It's mostly those with esteem issues who are more likely to spin a yarn.

 

This isn't the same with the girls. Thais have a weird relationship with truth. If a Hi-So Thai tells a lie to someone beneath them in rank, his story becomes the truth. If 10 people saw him shoot someone but he tells the police he didn't, it's the 10 who aren't believed. It's been part of Thai culture forever & it's the major obstacle for anyone hoping for justice. 

 

I have had girls tell me a lie when they didn't need to. There was nothing to gain by it but they still lied. When challenged they of course denied it. Even when I had the evidence all I got  was "farang lie, Thai people never lie. Farang bad, Thai people good."

 

And they absolutely believe it. When a Thai lies straight to your face & you can prove them wrong, it's our fault because we must have lied. I don't bring it up anymore but it is so infuriating when they do it in business because they won't take responsibility for their stuff-ups. That's when they suddenly forget how to speak English.

 

Just to balance the ledger though, what about all the times we lie to the girls? When we say we'll come back for them or take them another time or will buy them a drink later with no intention of ever doing it, isn't that the same thing? We are both guilty of telling fibs, no one has clean hands here.

[pdogg]

 

 

I have had girls tell me a lie when they didn't need to. There was nothing to gain by it but they still lied. 

There are two guys I knew way back when who were compulsive liars. These guys have nothing to do with Thailand or ladyboys.

 

I never knew if anything was true out of their mouths.  It could be something simple like if I said. "probably worth it to have very frequent oil changes" and the guy would say, "I get my oil changed every month".

 

On a different note, some girls like to accuse a guy of being a liar.  Doesn't win much points with most guys and the result is they'll just go with another girl who didn't call him a liar. 

[jerrysingapore]

 a couple of LT sessions of gut wrenching, bollock blistering, helmet hammering, meaningful, anal sex in some scabby hotel room with their current objects of desire that it far out ways & overrides any other sensibilities... And they'll do anything to carry favor, all sneaky & all behind your back too! .. They're just too far gone... Most of these blokes could be robbed, have their teeth kicked & then have the LB wipe their own excrement in their faces... And they'd still say, "I love yoo"!

 

 

 

 

 

I hadn't really thought about it like that......that is just sooooooooo romantic!! 

[JaiDee]

I know my stories get rather long-ish, but let me relate 2 things that happened to me over the years regarding another type of Heroes who took the word of a LB over a westerner for absolutely no reason.

 

1]I hear through the grapevine that a Photographer for a semi-popular LB website has it out for me, as he was told by some ladyboy at Casanova that *I* said he was infected with AIDS.  Of course I never said that at all and never would, and in fact didn't even know said ladyboy or the Photog, they were just names to me. She had told him in some weird revenge/retribution for myself never using her as a model, figuring that was a good way to get me back; "I will tell [X] that J.D. said he has AIDS, that will stir the pot for sure!"  For some reason that guy believed her with absolutely zero proof I had said it, and it took me a few months to clear it up; to this day I bet the guy never believed me and for some reason believed her; WHY?  When we all know they lie constantly?

 

2] Was a bit more personal. One of my good friends, an ex-Navy pilot for Korean Air, liked one of the models I had worked with. He saw her photos live and was the first one to call me on her, so I agreed to set him up with Benz, who now lives in London.

 

 Now, before her photos went live I had asked Benz out on a date myself, agreed upon when I got back from a week on Samui. The photos went live while I was down there, where the Pilot had sent me that letter, so I figured I would just blow Benz off; finding LB dates is as easy as walking into Nana, so why piss off a friend who liked her look and was prone to long-term relationships? Especially since I was more the one-nighter kind of guy, I'd much prefer to get someone like her every night of the week.

 

    On return from Samui she had already come to my place around 5pm, as we had agreed on dinner and a movie. Even before we went to Condoms and Cabbages on soi 12, a tourist hotspot, I had told her we would just do dinner and that was that; The Pilot/friend  had already called her and was looking forward to their date and I told Benz there was no way I could step on his toes.  But we were friends by then - I had even sent her pics to a TS magazine with worldwide circulation because I thought she was very photogenic -so I kept our innocent dinner date, but we both went our separate ways afterward; myself home by 7pm, she to her ''job'' at Kings 3. I even handed her 1000 baht for her time and of course paid for dinner, but I swear in no way did we have any sex, I never even kissed her at any time.

 

    A few days pass and I hear through the scene that The Pilot is very pissed off at me; that he had heard, from Benz, that I tried to fuck her and that SHE wasn't at all interested and had turned me down!  Beyond angry, I called that fucking bitch to make her correct things, but she never did; and despite my protestations to The Pilot he never once believed me, took her word 100%, and we have never been friends since; damn shame as he was a plain good guy and one of the few fellow Yanks I had met in the scene. I sent a few letters to Benz and tried to call her, but her only response was "sorry, I think I not understand you". Bullshit, she understood everything and her English was better than most LB's. 

 

So now I lose a good friend - even though in the end those 2 only dated for a few months he figured he could never trust me again - because some Ladyboy told him a boldface lie to save face and he believed her over me. Why the fuck would some guy whom I had known for years take the word of some bar girl he barely knew?

 

The kicker to this story; Benz did indeed make it into that worldwide magazine, not only with a photo spread of my pics with her contact info attached, but even with a cover shot!  She then became famous, sponsors bombarded her with cash, and she was able to leave Thailand for good to move to London. Hopefully Karma has caught up with her by now.

[deepthroat]

I've never gotten as twisted up about this as others, but that's probably because I'm not "on the ground" often enough for it to be an issue, or at least it hadn't been in the past. Appearing once a year and then vanishing, most of the girls had forgotten who I was by the time I reappeared the next year, so anything I posted over the period between was rendered moot. 

 

This past trip, I had a couple of girls - Rose from Sensations Bar in particular - ask some questions that implied they may have done some homework or had someone tip them off about my online personality. Prior to Sensations Bar, this had never happened to me before.

 

Hmmmm.......?

[pacman]

DT, the girls always check what's being posted about them. It's their version of gold mining, any pictures that were promised to stay private that finish up online is going to cost the poster. Anytime they see their name being talked about, they look for offence. That way they can confront the poster & demand of them: "why you talk bad about me? I want 2000!" Or more if they think it serious or if they think the person can pay. 

 

I know of several BMs who have been bullied into handing over cash. Some of the girls can be very intimidating. But what's worse are these 'heroes' who reveal what's in the private sections (let's hope there are none here). They have a lot to answer for. In a place where the girls will go with just about anyone who will pay them, these guys get attached to one girl & will do almost anything to keep her. It's the old male ego thing where they think if they can keep her from others that somehow they are winners.

 

It is completely delusional thinking. As these guys leave, *their* girl is meeting her next client. Of course she has told the last guy she loves him, that's BarGirl 101, always let him think he's special, that way he may start sending money when he gets home. And if the next guy is generous he'll hear the same.

 

I have challenged a girl & asked her how can she love 5 different customers. Her answer - "Lub farang not the same as Thai man, lub farang business". That's an exact quote from a popular girl, think about it.

[pacman]

"I will tell [X] that J.D. said he has AIDS, that will stir the pot for sure!"  For some reason that guy believed her with absolutely zero proof I had said it, 

 

It's only natural we apply our own standards of commonsense to those we meet in Thailand. It takes some adjusting to understand the girls are not logical creatures. Not by our standards at least. For us to accuse someone of being HIV+ is a big step. We automatically appreciate the ramifications of such an allegation, that we could be either sued or that we should expect retaliation. 

 

It's commonsense right? To us it is, not to these girls though. They just don't see past their immediate action. They have lived a life where everytime something came back to bite them, they would scream innocence & deny, deny, deny. This girl would have told the photographer her story without a care in the world. It would never occur to her that it was a lie with serious consequences. And if she repeats it a few times, it soon becomes the truth. Her truth of course but don't waste time arguing with her it isn't.

 

And the photographer is thinking with his western brain & cannot imagine someone could make up something so blatantly damaging, therefore, she must be telling the truth. It is simply incomprehensible that his friend would wish to make trouble for someone he hasn't met. And she is his friend for tipping him off to such slander. Without any rational reason for making something like that up, it must be true.

 

Why the fuck would some guy whom I had known for years take the word of some bar girl he barely knew?

 

IMO he has too much of an emotional investment in Benz for him not to believe her. He projected on her all the nice attributes he wanted in a girl & in that state of "love", he just doesn't want to believe she would lie to him.

 

He already had a gut feeling you wanted to sleep with her. Because he wanted to, you must have also. You took the sexy photos of her, there's his proof you fancied her & he probably harboured deep suspicions about your intentions from the moment he jacked off to the pictures.

 

And while we think Benz may be an ignorant farm girl from Issan, she knows exactly what buttons to press to get her new beau to try harder. And a harmless lie? How's that going to impact her? If anything is said, it is your word against hers & she can cry & scream & do everything with much more passion than you can. You had already lost once she told him it was true.

 

Telling a lie to a farang is par for the course with most of these girls, if it ever came to anything no Thai is ever going to believe a farang against the word of one their own. And as for your friend? Good riddance, he had a choice to make & it wasn't mutually exclusive. He could have accepted your story & still have maintained face with Benz. He didn't so fuck him. And his blind faith will have cost him plenty by now, I'm sure of it. 

 

 Hopefully Karma has caught up with her by now.

 

You can be positive it has. 

[bumblebee]

Another fine insight into how the Thais think Pacman.  Your posts are often enlightening to many of us, whether new to Thailand or been going there for a while..

[Swedeman007]

Another fine insight into how the Thais think Pacman.  Your posts are often enlightening to many of us, whether new to Thailand or been going there for a while..

 

I agree BB. Pacman is full of Thai wisdom and it is great to have someone like him basically tell it like it is, along with some of the unsaid logic, or lack there of, that applies to Thais and their way of thinking. -Swedeman007

[TEXASMAC]

 Pacman took me to a bar complex that I think was 25 miles from W/S. We sat there and he was so kind and brought a lovely Lady over to talk to me. She and I bartered about 500 bhat. This was when Pacman told me....

 

 

Get real you are 51 she is 23 , you are going to give that up for $17.00 for Long Time. I then realized I was an ass. Thanks Pacman.

[pacman]

Another fine insight into how the Thais think Pacman.  Your posts are often enlightening to many of us, whether new to Thailand or been going there for a while..

 

You're very kind BB. I like writing about this stuff so if anyone reads it, I am always happy.

 

I agree BB. Pacman is full of Thai wisdom and it is great to have someone like him basically tell it like it is, along with some of the unsaid logic, or lack there of, that applies to Thais and their way of thinking. -Swedeman007

 

Cheers Swedeman. As Mark Twain observed - East is east & west is west & never the twain shall meet. 

 

I don't know about being full of Thai logic but some would argue I'm definitely full of something...       

 

 Pacman took me to a bar complex that I think was 25 miles from W/S. We sat there and he was so kind and brought a lovely Lady over to talk to me. She and I bartered about 500 bhat. This was when Pacman told me....

 

 

Get real you are 51 she is 23 , you are going to give that up for $17.00 for Long Time. I then realized I was an ass. Thanks Pacman.

 

Tex, I never knew I was so influential in your life. That night was a long time ago but if the advise has helped you, you're welcome...         

 

And we weren't 25 miles away, we were in Family Bar in Naklua...          

[JaiDee]

I read your reply also Paccers, and you surely hit the nail on the head.

 

 Being from the west we understand how lies work and the consequences of them, etc.....and we can never fathom someone doing it and not even batting an eyelash.  For the people we deal with in "the scene" their thinking is 100% different, obviously; I also remember the frequent "my friend she in hospital na, sorry can not meet with you tonight" excuse.  Really?  That's the best you can come up with?  And you think I am going to believe that?

 

    Still though, your explanation covers the Thai angle, which I had already gotten, but only absolves The Pilot because he was "in love". No excuse in my book. 

 

    He had a good friend telling him one thing and an LB from Patpong whom he had literally just met telling him another; and he believes her only because he WANTS to believe her -and of course because he wants to fuck her. He knew I was regularly meeting 5 or 6 new girls a week, having them strip and taking naked photos of them; any of them, and I do mean 100% of them, were available for a few more baht, same as they are too all of us. Sure, Benz looked good,  but so did the girl the next day, and the day after that, and the day after that; if he or any other friend asked me to back off someone they liked, of course I would have and in fact oftentimes did.

 

  Again, it kinda blows my mind not from the Thai angle - I am used to that - but from the falang angle. I couldn't even imagine a ladyboy telling me something negative about a friend and just dumping that friend for good without first hearing his side of the story.

 

        I think many punters can put up with the lies and bullshit a lot better than I can. I happily left it all behind after 5 or 6 years ...still kept going to Thailand but refused to be part of any 'scene' except on the peripheries ...... and while I still had to put up with lies from Thais [new rhyming slogan for TAT?] on the island I moved to, at least I wasn't getting bullshit  from the people I slept with.