Three somewhat obscure movies, everyone should see

[Kahuna]

Not at all is my answer to your first question.

 

Personally I do not think using the word "nigger" is such big deal.  Even your question does not use the word. You refer to the "N" word. Nonetheless the word is part of history and as such we cannot erase or hide it if we wish to teach our history honestly.  

 

Of course I expect violence in his films....But that doesn't mean that I enjoy watching all the violence...If it serves a purpose in the story telling fine...After a bit in this film it became gratuitous...Way over done in my mind...

 

And we disagree once more...The "N" word is horrible...I agree that in this story we needed to be reminded how horrid a word it is...But not every other sentence...There were some great black actors in Django and I haven't heard any complaints from them...But at least one outsider whose opinion I respect...Denzel...has voiced some concern...Personally I don't say that word nor write it...That doesn't mean others like yourself can't though...But please don't criticize me for not using the "N" word in my post...

 

Neither one of my observations means that I didn't enjoy the film and I think it was an entertaining 2+ hour experience...I will have a copy in my film library when it is available and I will enjoy watching it again and again as I do all his other films...

 

Tarantino is not an historian...He is a film maker...And a very good one at that...But in my mind he can neither write nor rewrite history...That ain't his job...

[SiamSam]

Wasn't criticizing you for not using the "N" word at all Kahuna. I was simply trying to say (perhaps poorly) that nobody wants to say the word anymore and your reference to the "N word" in your post was an example of that. I wasn't judging. It was a statement and certainly not a criticism. 

[Kahuna]

Gotcha Sam...I simply didn't understand what you were saying in your first post...and I don't disagree...I just thought that with your very strong feelings about guns and gun control you might have looked at the film a bit differently...

 

Be a damn horrid world if we all shared the same thoughts...wore the same clothes...spoke the same language...had the same color skin...

 

The World is a better place cause of you and your opinions Sam...Might even be a slight bit better cause of mine, although there is a debate brewing in some quarters against that thought as I type...

[SiamSam]

Yes you're right Kahuna. I hate guns and think the world would be a whole lot of a better place it they were totally banned. No doubt about that. However I feel the same way about other things like Nazis. Doesn't mean I can't enjoy a well constructed piece of entertainment about them, pro or con.

 

Like I said in my post. If you are going to see a QT movie expect to see a lot of what he likes to do and what he does well. I am not a big opera fan and as such I don't go out to the opera. In the event I ever did, I would know what to expect and not come away from it saying the show was good but there was much too much opera singing. 

 

Ok, I am wide open now. Come and get me!!! 

[dixon cox]

Without wishing to sound offensive, purely an observation... But the word 'nigger' seems to be the exclusive domain of themselves. If anyone outside of that demographic were to say it THEN it is offensive, but if spoken by one to another then it is acceptable by them.

 

I feel I am being offensive even by resisting the use of certain other words here despite using the 'N' word already. No offence to anyone intended, it is just an observation described in a clumsy way. Clumsy that is for anyone who isn't a member of that demographic.

 

I realise this thread is about movies, but I've been watching 'The Wire' and it must be used at least 50 times per episode. But only by that particular demographic to others within it, never used by anyone else.

[seven]

Without wishing to sound offensive, purely an observation... But the word 'nigger' seems to be the exclusive domain of themselves. If anyone outside of that demographic were to say it THEN it is offensive, but if spoken by one to another then it is acceptable by them.

 

I feel I am being offensive even by resisting the use of certain other words here despite using the 'N' word already. No offence to anyone intended, it is just an observation described in a clumsy way. Clumsy that is for anyone who isn't a member of that demographic.

 

I realise this thread is about movies, but I've been watching 'The Wire' and it must be used at least 50 times per episode. But only by that particular demographic to others within it, never used by anyone else.

How about if we use the thaiversion; Chocolate man?

[Kahuna]

Ok, I am wide open now. Come and get me!!! 

 

Jermaine Spradley tells us in a recent piece in the Huffingon Post that, "Django's most important achievement              is that it forces us to come to terms with the fact that it's completely possible to be both thoroughly entertained...      and thoroughly offended."

 

And that, in my view, reflects my opinion of Django Unchained...I was both entertained and offended...

 

Perhaps that is what Tarantino intended...

[JaiDee]

Speaking of Denzel, he must have said the word "nigger" in Training Day at least a dozen times. "My nigga" to Ethan Hawke several times alone. {Great movie by the way,  Denzel was at his best}.

 

  I agree it should be a word which is exclusively the domain of black people........I know that sounds odd, but I think if they are using it between themselves that kind of makes it OK?  I dunno......don't care for the word in general, never use it myself, and don't like it when I hear it from other white people.....Tarantino used it himself a few times in Pulp Fiction also and that made me cringe.

 

  I'm  a lily-white Irish boy with freckles from a northern state which has 94% of white people who look just like me.....never had time or the need for racism, and never had a lot of different nationalities around to hate on! So I don't get the word and don't like it, it sounds like something that should be coming out of the mouth of some southern redneck like eighty years ago.

[pacman]

And that, in my view, reflects my opinion of Django Unchained...I was both entertained and offended...

 

Perhaps that is what Tarantino intended...

 

Perhaps doesn't come into it. That's exactly what QT sets out to do. He wants to shock his audience & presents us with anti-heroes who appeal to our most innate values. Real primal instinct stuff that harks back to the simple values we had as children.

 

I remember an interview with J K Rowling when she was being criticised for all the violence in her Harry Potter books. Why did all the bad people have to die, they could have been brought to justice thus saving kiddies from nightmares was the premise of the question.

 

Rowlings replied something like this: "children don't want wishy washy outcomes for the villains, they aren't interested in negotiated settlements & lenient sentences, they want the good guys to kill the bad guys in the way the understand justice at its most basic level. It's more upsetting for them if the bad guy gets away. Watch them cheer at cartoons when the baddie gets his just desserts."

 

And so it is with QT. He smacks us in the face with rampant evil, he triggers our thirst for justice, then he doles out revenge slowly & thoroughly. And he does it properly. No one dies an easy death, they get slaughtered. It refreshes us as people because in a world gone mad with injustice & political correctness, here is a fantasy portrayal of how life should be.

 

And if anyone gets offended by QT's style, they are taking life a tad too serious. IMO.

[pacman]

Maybe I am just not a sophisticated enough of a movie fan. 

 

Somebody needs a hug...    

 

In my opinion we are ALL valid critics. Whatever you think is what YOU think. Your opinion (and mine) is just as valid as the next person's. What I dislike is when people (critics) think that a film is naff purely because it is commercial or because it is not intelligent enough. A movie should captivate and entertain. There is nothing clever or sophisticated about liking a movie just because few others have seen it or because it is smart. Sophistication often equals pompous.

 

Agree completely DC. I know Lefty was being completely disingenuous but there are no right or wrong opinions, there are just different opinions. No one can tell me what I will or won't like, they can recommend or warn me off but they can never anticipate my thinking. 

 

I am my own man. No one can change my mind. Is that OK with everyone?             

[Kahuna]

And if anyone gets offended by QT's style, they are taking life a tad too serious. IMO.

 

I truly am offended and truly amazed that  others are not...I honestly try not to take life too seriously Paccie at least what little remains to me but frankly I am surprised....

 

I realize that you ain't seen the film so allow me to explain a couple features of this fine film...

 

There are a horde of white folks in this film...and they are all...down to the very last one, depicted as the worst of human kind that could ever be found anywhere save one and he just happens to not be a Yank...Do you think it was really that way in the southern states during slavery...

 

And all of the black folks  save two are portrayed as dumb frightened fools...

 

The main character would have my sympathy if he cared for his own kind even a little...But he is portrayed as only being concerned with his own interests...solely with his own interests...He cares very little about helping other black folks...Do you really think that blacks during slavery did not try and care for their own...

 

Well I am sorry cause that is a false picture that Quentin has painted...There were many white folks in the south who cared about human life and the human spirit and there were many black slaves who fought back...

 

Again, it both entertained and offended me...and that's not a bad thing...And I am certain that I will pick up a copy when available and be entertained and offended all over again many times...

 

I like Tarantino and I like all his of films...And not a one is a perfect film...They all are flawed...As evidence that I am not biased I offer the following..................................

 

My QT DVD collection

 

My favorite wallet...It surely gets a response every time I take it out of my pocket to pay the bill...

 

Several posters in my junk room office...

[pacman]

I truly am offended and truly amazed that  others are not...I honestly try not to take life too seriously Paccie at least what little remains to me but frankly I am surprised....

 

That does sound pretty damn offensive. I strongly suspect I am going to feel exactly the same. And if not for research purposes, I could happily live without seeing Django. But then how do I participate in this chat? 

 

In defense of the comment:  "And if anyone gets offended by QT's style, they are taking life a tad too serious. IMO", I could argue that I was referring to his style & not a specific movie but one can't be separated from the other & I am not going to weasel out of what I wrote. I didn't give it a lot of thought though & after reading your synopsis of Django, I would not write it now.

 

While I was writing my earlier post about QT & his need to shock his audience, I did muse about what comes next after playing the race card? He's done the gangster & the Nazi stories, what next? Maybe child molesters being boiled in oil or evil ladyboys biting clients cocks off? Offensive as hell but guaranteed to be entertaining.

[Hefe]

Back to actors for a minute, someone mentioned Benicio del Toro a while back & I think he is a fine actor. His performance in the excellent movie "21 Grams", believed we talked about that earlier, well that film & performance really stayed with me for a while ( & Sean Penn was really good in that too).

 

Which bring to mind a couple of other interesting grim films I saw last year. "The Sea Within" the always watchable Javier Bardem in his quest to die on his own terms, & "The Diving Bell & The Butterfly" by the visual artist Julian Schnabel about a man's nightmarish existence desperately clinging to the barest remnants of his life. The fact both are based on true first person accounts of dealing with the extremes of mortality make them pretty gripping, although TDB&B is a much more visually stylized film & more subjective in approach.

[Kahuna]

You gotta see it Paccie...It will offend you but it will also entertain you...It is easy for me to be critical, but QT is a whole lot smarter than I am and knows a whole lot more about making a film than I do...It is a remarkable film...and I will be disappointed and you will regret it if you don't see Django (the "D" is silent) Unchained...

 

What's next...he claims one more and that is the end of QT films...10 films is his max...I doubt it...He is too young to become a Hollywood wallflower...

[iceberg]

This one is pretty obscure and it's one of my favorite movies! Not big budget by any means and no famous actores but I like it a lot,and even watched it while waiting for my flight to LOS, in the ATL airport in 2011. It's available on Youtube for free, so enjoy. Or not but I liked it.

 

http://youtu.be/H2hb6GUiq5w

 

[Lefty]

As it happens I just watched Good Will Hunting the other day, a truly excellent movie which I've seen numerous times, perhaps one of Matt Damon's best and Affleck was very good too. But in my opinion the outstanding performance went to Robin Williams, who as a comedian I cannot stand, but as a serious actor I find very watchable. I'll be watching Awakenings again soon too.

 

I generally enjoy DiCaprio. I recently watched This Boy's Life and Basketball Diaries, both very enjoyable.

 

The Town was highly enjoyable too, much recommended, Ben Affleck was superb in that.

 

Brad Pitt was mentioned recently and that made me watch Sleepers again. Kevin Bacon, Robert DeNiro, Brad Pitt, Dustin Hoffman and Bruno Kirby. Another great movie.

 

On the subject of Tarantino. I've enjoyed all that I've seen with particular mentions to Pulp Fiction, Jackie Brown and True Romance, loved them. Never saw any of his Kill Bill movies though, just something about them never appealed.

 

 

 

In my opinion we are ALL valid critics. Whatever you think is what YOU think. Your opinion (and mine) is just as valid as the next person's. What I dislike is when people (critics) think that a film is naff purely because it is commercial or because it is not intelligent enough. A movie should captivate and entertain. There is nothing clever or sophisticated about liking a movie just because few others have seen it or because it is smart. Sophistication often equals pompous.

My favorite Robin Williams movie was Dead Poets Society. like you say, he is best in dramatic roles, even though he made his name known to most of us at first through comedy roles, like Mork and Mindy. 

 

Yeah, The Town is superb. JD raved about it so much I had to see it. I even watched both the theatrical and uncut versions to see which one I preferred, and I like the uncut version best. Still not too long a movie with the extra 30 minutes. The best role in that movie for me was played by Jeremy Renner. Then I saw him in The Hurt Locker. That young fella can sure act. 

 

Another good Brad Pitt role was in Burn After Reading. Just as they do with Clooney, the Coens did a fine job of putting Pitt in the role of a bumbling doofus. I hear people speak negatively of his acting in Inglourious Basterds and I certainly do NOT agree with them. I really cannot think of any role of his that I found lacking. First seem him in Thelma and Louise and he looked so good without a shirt, that he'd even have gotten the most macho of macho men such as Siam Sam and Pacman to have homoerotic thoughts I suspect.   

 

TBH, the Kill Bill movies were my least favorite QT movies. They seemed so long and dragged out to me. Also, I'm not into sword fight and or martial arts types of movies anyway. But, because it was from him, there is enough good stuff in both to make them worth watching. See how many times you can spot Michael Parks in various roles, 555. It's not a QT movie with a small role or two for Michael Parks. That's fine by me, I think he is a good old character actor. 

 

My QT rankings goes like this: Inglourious Basterds, Pulp Fiction, Django Unchained, Jackie Brown, True Romance., Death Proof,  Reservoir Dogs, Kill Bill 1 and 2. 

 

I completely agree with your entire last paragraph. I get tired of hearing people say this guy or that guy cannot act. John Wayne used to be a frequent target for such comments, and I cannot agree. Wayne, and also Eastwood probably combined to give me more hours of movie viewing enjoyment than any 2 other actors ever in history. 

 I am reminded of the words to a Statler Bros song about the world of movies: "everybody is trying to make a comment about our hopes and fears, True Grit's the only movie I've really understood in years. You gotta take your analyst along to see if it's fit to see. Whatever happened to Randolph Scott has happened to the best of me. Whatever happened to Randolph Scott has happened to the industry. 

[Lefty]

I don't mind at all when critics feel differently about certain movies than I do, or when other board members do the same......it's all a matter of what a person likes, who really cares what others think?  We can get idea's from other people,. but it all comes down to what WE like, not them.

 

 Will Ferrell makes a ton of movies people seem to find funny......I watched one of his on an airplane once and found him to be completely unfunny and have never watched anything from him again and never will, I just don't get his 'comedy' at all. Same with the fat guy from King of Queens; while that show is decent, I am 100% sure I could never sit through 2 hours of Mall Cop.

 

  Doesn't mean people who like them are 'unsophisticated', it just means they like different comedy material than I do. What I don't like is when someone will say "Oh, you didn't like {X}?"   or  "you don't think {Y} is a fine actor?"  Then you must be a stupid fool! No, because someone doesn't like their material or they way they act in it, it doesn't make them 'stupid', it just means 2 people have different tastes.

 

   OK, back to this crop of 30's and 40's actors; I think DiCaprio is OK; liked him in Blood Diamond and Gilbert Grape, also in The Departed, Body of Lies, Gangs of New York.......never saw Titanic, and never will; again, all subjective. He also did a good job in The Beach, filmed in the Koh Phi Phi area.

 

      Damon started out gangbusters in Good Will Hunting, a great movie Affleck was in also....as mentioned above Robin Williams played a good role and was awarded with Best Supporting Actor for his trouble. Damon also did very well in; The Talented Mr Ripley, Ocean's Eleven, Saving Private Ryan, The Informant and the 3 Bourne movies he was in. I loved those 3 movies, some people may think they were junk but that doesn't matter to me at all; they entertain ME and that's all I care about when I sit down to watch a movie. I thought he over-acted in The Departed, and why fake a Boston accent when you naturally have one? In fact, only Mark Wahlberg nailed the accent in that one, everyone else sounded completely phony.

 

            I do like Wahlberg, but he has made some stink bombs recently like Contraband.....he was great in Three Kings and The Perfect Storm, Boogie Nights also....Clooney and Pitt are just a little old to be in this group but I like them both a lot also. Don't care much for Johnny Depp, he comes across as a male bimbo to me and I don't get the Pirates of the Caribbean stuff at all.  Tom Cruise = NO......Denzel Washington, a resounding YES....Colin Farrell, NO. Edward Norton is very good, Sean Penn also.....lots of good actors in that generation.

 

While I consider Will Farrell really funny,(who couldn't laugh at his More Cowbell skit on SNL), I totally agree about Kevin James. Maybe it is just that he usually plays annoying characters. I did think he was ok in I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry. I bet you hated that, since it was also Sandler, whom  I love. 555.  I watch King of Queens reruns just because Leah Remini is hot, and Jerry Stiller is hilarious.  It seems so unrealistic that a hottie like her would be married to a fat slob like Kevin James. Well, it is a sitcom after all, so realism isn't a consideration I guess and some hot chicks may have a fat fetish, 

[Lefty]

Without wishing to sound offensive, purely an observation... But the word 'nigger' seems to be the exclusive domain of themselves. If anyone outside of that demographic were to say it THEN it is offensive, but if spoken by one to another then it is acceptable by them.

 

I feel I am being offensive even by resisting the use of certain other words here despite using the 'N' word already. No offence to anyone intended, it is just an observation described in a clumsy way. Clumsy that is for anyone who isn't a member of that demographic.

 

I realise this thread is about movies, but I've been watching 'The Wire' and it must be used at least 50 times per episode. But only by that particular demographic to others within it, never used by anyone else.

 

If you added up all the times the N word is used in QT movies, I'll bet Samuel Jackson says it more than anyone else. I do not feel comfortable saying it to or about anyone either, but certainly do not begrudge others the right to if they feel like it.  I see it's use just the same as you do, Black folks can use it among themselves toward one another, but it seems out of place for us to join in, even if used in the same manner.

[Lefty]

Yes you're right Kahuna. I hate guns and think the world would be a whole lot of a better place it they were totally banned. No doubt about that. However I feel the same way about other things like Nazis. Doesn't mean I can't enjoy a well constructed piece of entertainment about them, pro or con.

 

Like I said in my post. If you are going to see a QT movie expect to see a lot of what he likes to do and what he does well. I am not a big opera fan and as such I don't go out to the opera. In the event I ever did, I would know what to expect and not come away from it saying the show was good but there was much too much opera singing. 

 

Ok, I am wide open now. Come and get me!!! 

 

I am basically the opposite. I was raised in a gun owning and hunting family, and learned to shoot a .22 rifle when I was 6. I cannot remember how many deer and elk I've killed. No better eating than fresh venison backstrap. :) 

 

As I spent time in the Philippines, I saw private armed guards on duty at basically every business. Every bank had at least 3 and at least 2 of them with shotguns. One bank had one of their group of guards carrying an AR15. Pawn Shops, drug stores, McDonalds, etc. Other than bars and the public market I saw armed guards just about everywhere, including schools. Maybe some bars did too, but kept them in a more discrete mode while still being vigilant. 

IMO, it is totally too idealistic to think we could ever rid the world of guns. IMO, the solution, while not foolproof is do what they do in the Philippines, Trained, armed guards at every school. They say that would cost about $1 billion a year, Well, compared to the money that we give away to other countries and sticking our noses into other country's business, it would be a drop in the bucket. Maybe it would not prevent all school shootings but IMO it would prevent most of them. As it was explained to me, people like the lunatic in Connecticut carry out their acts of violence as long as they feel in control. The presence of an armed guard or two at that school would IMO prevented him from ever even attempting what he did. You know when he stopped shooting people? When he heard the police sirens. He knew he would very soon no longer be in control, so he went downstairs and shot himself. I honestly do not believe 95% of those insane fools who shoot up schools would even attempt it if they knew they had to get past armed guards to do it. Just my humble opinion. Feel free to disagree, 

[Lefty]

Perhaps doesn't come into it. That's exactly what QT sets out to do. He wants to shock his audience & presents us with anti-heroes who appeal to our most innate values. Real primal instinct stuff that harks back to the simple values we had as children.

 

I remember an interview with J K Rowling when she was being criticised for all the violence in her Harry Potter books. Why did all the bad people have to die, they could have been brought to justice thus saving kiddies from nightmares was the premise of the question.

 

Rowlings replied something like this: "children don't want wishy washy outcomes for the villains, they aren't interested in negotiated settlements & lenient sentences, they want the good guys to kill the bad guys in the way the understand justice at its most basic level. It's more upsetting for them if the bad guy gets away. Watch them cheer at cartoons when the baddie gets his just desserts."

 

And so it is with QT. He smacks us in the face with rampant evil, he triggers our thirst for justice, then he doles out revenge slowly & thoroughly. And he does it properly. No one dies an easy death, they get slaughtered. It refreshes us as people because in a world gone mad with injustice & political correctness, here is a fantasy portrayal of how life should be.

 

And if anyone gets offended by QT's style, they are taking life a tad too serious. IMO.

 

Wow, Paccie, that was impressive, and I think you nailed it spot on. I cheer like a kid watching cartoon bad guys getting their just desserts too, when I see it in QT movies. I think #1 for me was the final scene of Death Proof, when the psycho Stuntman Mike is reduced to a crying sniveling baby, begging for his life. The 3 girls who he'd just been trying to kill with his car, were having none of it, and proceeded to kick the living shit out of him right down to his dying breath, and for me, when they all raised their arms in victory, I wanted to do the same. 

 

I could say the same about Donny and Omar up there in the theater box mowing down the trapped Nazis with their machine guns in  Inglourious Basterds. Or how about when they are all watching that movie of the Nazi Sniper and the spliced in segment of Shosanna comes on the screen telling them they are all going to die and to look into the face of the Jew who was going to do it. 

[Lefty]

You gotta see it Paccie...It will offend you but it will also entertain you...It is easy for me to be critical, but QT is a whole lot smarter than I am and knows a whole lot more about making a film than I do...It is a remarkable film...and I will be disappointed and you will regret it if you don't see Django (the "D" is silent) Unchained...

 

What's next...he claims one more and that is the end of QT films...10 films is his max...I doubt it...He is too young to become a Hollywood wallflower...

I doubt it too. As for what is next, according to IMDB.com, Kill Bill 3 has been announced. as his next movie.  Just my opinion, but I'd expect QT to be making movies for at least 10 more years.  By my count, Django was his 8th movie that he directed, unless one wants to include the segment he directed in Four Rooms, his being listed as guest director in Sin City, or the short film he did back in 1987, My Best Friend's Birthday, which I do not include.

 

[Lefty]

Gotcha Sam...I simply didn't understand what you were saying in your first post...and I don't disagree...I just thought that with your very strong feelings about guns and gun control you might have looked at the film a bit differently...

 

Be a damn horrid world if we all shared the same thoughts...wore the same clothes...spoke the same language...had the same color skin...

 

The World is a better place cause of you and your opinions Sam...Might even be a slight bit better cause of mine, although there is a debate brewing in some quarters against that thought as I type...

I'd say the people who know you are much more than a slight bit better because of your opinions. They are all expressed quite eloquently. are often thought provoking, and even when other's do not agree with them, they should  not begrudge you your right to voice them., I'm pretty sure not everyone thinks highly of many of my opinions either, or that of some of the other folks here. So in this regard you are hardly alone. 

[pacman]

I'd say the people who know you are much more than a slight bit better because of your opinions. They are all expressed quite eloquently. are often thought provoking, and even when other's do not agree with them, they should  not begrudge you your right to voice them., 

 

I think everyone's opinion deserves to be respected. Unless I don't agree with them...        

 

 The Big Kahuna's contributions are often the highlight of my day. I need to get out more...        

 

 

I'm pretty sure not everyone thinks highly of many of my opinions either, or that of some of the other folks here. So in this regard you are hardly alone.  

 

 

Somebody still needs a hug...          

[JaiDee]

I noticed on ads for the new movie "Broken City" .....being pushed quite hard on the tube these days......that Mark Wahlberg gets lead billing ahead of Russell Crowe.

 

  Was I asleep when Russell Crowe all of a sudden became less of a star than Marky Mark?

[Kahuna]

Mark is the producer and Russell ain't...Maybe that had something to do with it...Then maybe, they just thought that Mark would bring more young folks into the theater and make more money...Sometimes I do forget that making movies is in business...